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Post by JRavens on Aug 29, 2015 0:39:43 GMT
That doesn't work  rats... I swapped the buzzer with something:  The first iteration though t was just a static prop. Booo!  So I added some entries from the buzzer. Huzzah!  But then when you get in the camera goes NUTS and spins in 360 degrees all over the place (not even sure how this snapped a single frame because I was convinced it was spinnin faster than 60 fps)  Too bad. Maybe I'll figure out how to fix it some time. I WAS able to move the helicopter (i.e. fly it in a fashion like the buzzer), but the camera made it impossible to play. :/ |
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Post by flanker1six on Aug 29, 2015 11:23:08 GMT
Can I be your door gunner? It would be really nice (and cool) if you can figure out what the heck is going on with the inside perspective so it's usable!
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Post by willyr1100 on Aug 29, 2015 13:52:43 GMT
Holy Cow, this is way past cool
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Post by JRavens on Aug 29, 2015 15:21:26 GMT
It was really cool. The fact that they fully detailed the interior (well what I could see of it anyway) made it neat and they defined sitpoints (so they could NPCs in there). I flew it a short distance away from Ajays house, but of course I couldn't see sh%t because of the camera spazzing out. Tried it a couple times and when you bail out sometimes you hit the rotors (oops!) and either die or almost die.
I'll try comparing them again and see if I can figure out what setting is needed. So hard because so much is undefined and you're just picking through line after line of "meaningless" code.
What would be really cool if it would only spawn at Ajays house. That would make the helipad upgrade awesome. In that test I did it spawned wherever a Buzzer would (I ran across a camo painted one later down in the valley).
But from this test I figured out how I could really mess with spawn points. Not sure what to DO with that though... I was thinking of removing a lot of vehicles from the game and just keeping the predefined ones like the buzzer outside the first outpost and one of the gliders outside Banapaur (why the hell did they put TWO gliders practically side by side there?? And one of them sometimes glitches into the damn tree... honestly that's the FIRST real mission area. Someone HAD to have playtested the hell out of that area O.o)
What would be a good vehicle to swap up there at Ajays House if I can't get the heli working? I was thinking a hovercraft or a quad bike (good luck Evel Knieval!)
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Post by willyr1100 on Aug 29, 2015 16:13:54 GMT
man, that's a tough call, if you walk up the trail to the house you need the glider for the first Shangri-La mission after the arena to get to the island if ur in a hurry, and u still need a buzzer for long range foray's, for me the hover craft is Mr. toad's wild ride so I'll pass on that, so I would go for the quad and wing suit I think that will take a lot of practice, my 2 c worth thks
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Post by pj on Aug 29, 2015 16:34:50 GMT
"Cool" would be Mr. Kilgore's Huey...
Coupla speakers outside the doors playing Wagner... you know - daah-da-da-daaaah-da, daah-da-da-daaaah-da, daah-da-da-daaaah-da, daah-da-da-daaah-daaaaaaaahhh.... Boom! dadadadadadadadad. Ka-BOOOOMM!
"Outstanding, Red Team, outstanding! Get you a case of beer for that one. "
Yeahhh!
Oh.... the adrenaline...
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Post by bontainer on Aug 29, 2015 18:00:01 GMT
Really cool, I would love to get rid of all the buzzers (but the fortress and Ajays house) for the Nightmare mod.
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Post by mikeweeks2346 on Aug 29, 2015 21:12:11 GMT
Really cool, I would love to get rid of all the buzzers (but the fortress and Ajays house) for the Nightmare mod. Without fast travel in nightmare the various spawning buzzer (if it takes place) locations are critical for not dragging the game play out even longer when it's time to wrap up a game session.
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Post by pj on Aug 29, 2015 23:31:00 GMT
Yeah Mike: I don't mind the absence of fast travel because one wouldn't have this in real life - but a Buzzer - or more "Buzzer Stations" (provided through Longinus's benevolence) are then much more of a necessity to keep natural frustration in it's place. Walking is dangerous, and driving anything - even more so.
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Post by mikeweeks2346 on Aug 30, 2015 3:27:48 GMT
Yup PJ, you're spot on. Lack of fast travel is indeed just fine, and when Ajay looks at his watch and realizes he should have gone to bed hours ago, locating a buzzer only makes sense ...
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Post by bontainer on Aug 30, 2015 18:24:57 GMT
Well, but the Nightmare mod should make the game as hard as possible. And the Buzzer is making the game way too easy. After finishing Part One, it takes you about an hour to free all but two belltowers, by just landing on the top platform. This also gives you the P416 and the Z93, courtesy of the northernmost tower in the South.
So the deactivating of the buzzer was top on my list.
In addition there are quite a few vehicles that make travel easy, too. Try the waterway via hovercraft, nearly as enemyfree as flying, and as fast.
In my view the buzzer is an exploit , that is sadly needed, because some towers are just not climbable. But overall it takes a lot away from the game. There are so many beautiful places, you will never see, so many things you can`t discover from the air, just give it a try.
Furhteron the save game function will let you continue at the same location where you exited the game, give it a try, too.
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Post by JRavens on Aug 30, 2015 19:06:23 GMT
Sorry guys I hate to be on the minority side too, but I agree with bontainer. The buzzer is fun, but it's another "toy" they gave us rather than a tool. The AI can barely deal with you at height (and in fact you can even lift above their firing range) and it makes the bell towers dead easy. Think about this - we didn't have a buzzer in FC3 and still got along ok (and we DEFINITELY never had all these fast jump around vehicles in FC2). You won't be zipping around in a buzzer in DZiggy's Nightmare mod either. I wouldn't mind having a few spawn in the world (like at Ajays house if you buy a massively expensive upgrade), but they are way too easy to find and they remove a lot of danger from traveling. I'm not going to alter them in hardcore, but I would say any mod that is looking to up the difficulty should remove them or at least severely limit their access. Unless we could find other options like making them more frail and prone to damage (from enemies and tree branches) or lowering their max altitude to keep you within the danger zone. I think there is at least one bell tower that is too high for the buzzer to reach and I'm kind of surprised they didn't do that with more of them. This heli thing was more of a "oh that would be cool - wonder if I can do it" sort of thing. I definitely wasn't going for any kind of balance with it. PS - I got a glitchy version working where Ajay sits on the roof and it's fully navigable, but the entry and exit animations are all borked ...and he's... sitting on the cockpit roof sooo. Anyway there is no height ceiling on the blackhawk like their is with the buzzer so I went a ridiculous height up and bailed out and spent a few minutes wingsuiting down to earth which ended up being pretty neat. Sadly after tinkering for hours I just cannot seem to get him inside the heli with a normal camera that you can control So for now it's still a failed experiment. |
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Post by mikeweeks2346 on Aug 30, 2015 22:28:40 GMT
What makes the nightmare game "as hard as possible" as currently configured is the damage by weapons to the player. The game is now more of voiding direct combat and more stealth to accomplish goals. You don't want to be on the roads at all, and only do a minimum amount of traveling on the waterways.
I don't use any buzzer to directly clear a bell tower for the simple reason of the spawning NPCs that are attracted to it; their fire is deadly. I however will use a buzzer to get somewhere near a bell tower, away from NPCs (hopefully), then climb the tower - all of which are climbable (south and north) in my gaming experience.
Besides, there's no way you are going to land a buzzer at Tower 10 (if going only for the P416/Z93) and survive. In addition, the P416 (if you even want it for use in the south) is available at another location, Cragway Rest.
As far as exiting the game - nothing so incomplete as ending a session not at a safe house location. Can't imagine any serious player saying "time to quite" while in the middle of a field, and pressing the save, exit buttons. In fact did Ubisoft ever fix the lack of the save features working properly? I ALWAYS want to be at a safe house, to unload the loot bag if nothing else and use the known save feature of advancing time via the bed feature, then use the save button, then exit. I know that system actually works.
It's totally misleading to assume that if one uses a buzzer that they are not exploring on foot, and discovering "new" places. It happens all the time. The buzzer is there to simply get one to a specific (or near it) location - normally for a specific purpose, such as wanting to exit the game at a specific safe house location.
If it's felt the buzzer is a toy, and not a tool, in IMHO so is the hovercraft.
No buzzer's in FC3 isn't an issue because the land mass are two separate islands and on each island are direct mountain ridges (w/out any spawning NPCs with one exception) which allows for rather rapid foot travel. Besides the glider system works quite well in FC3 for leap-frogging on both islands - unlike the totally screwed-up glider system introduced in FC4 - a system that more than likely gets you killed (either on launch or landing) then not.
I haven't found spawning buzzers "too easy to find" since they don't always spawn in-game. I've recorded where they have spawned in my gaming experience and outside just a few "sure-fire" locations there's never any guarantee that a buzzer will spawn where it has previously.
It all simply comes down to how much larger is the play area within FC4 versus FC2 and -3. If there's no means within the game to possibly wrap up your activity cleanly and somewhat quickly it's downright boring, non-enjoyable gaming, given how Ubisoft structured the save/re-spawning system. |
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Post by pj on Aug 30, 2015 23:42:10 GMT
"After finishing Part One, it takes you about an hour to free all but two belltowers, by just landing on the top platform. This also gives you the P416 and the Z93, courtesy of the northernmost tower in the South. " So - get rid of the free popgun altogether then Peter! This is what I did, then made them ultra expensive. (As an aside - one doesn't even need to finish Part 1 to get that chopper, either - one can double back to that little "hostage" villiage that you take just before Khilana Bazaar, and climb, run, walk northwards up the hills to the immediate north of the houses. That will drop you on the other side of the blue buses, where you can do lots of satisfying things - as well as finding a certain helicopter - and not have to endure that fat idiot ond his GP homie friend. "to up the difficulty should remove them or at least severely limit their access." Nope.. Sorry, Jeff - they have become invaluable to AJay's mobility, and generally enabling a satisfactory end to the gaming session. I don't have fast travel enabled because it definitely is a "toy", and - again as Mike alludes - I want to be in a safe house before I shut down. Increase the damage - as you said - trees, ground fire, damage done by building, rocks, cliff faces - and yes - the catwalk around the top level of the tower, plus whatever's left of the stonework. I couldn't even imagine putting an ultralight chopper onto those platforms: it would be game over inside of three seconds. That "fragility" needs to be increased if at all possible - if only in a similar fashion to the no-fly zone surrounding Chal Jama. That would at least keep it away from the towers. Ajay flying a two-man troop-carrying machine... Ajay? Jeffery! Are you serious? Having served on an "overseas" helicopter detachment "a few years back" - I will accept that he and a few of his motely GP crew have the capacity to maintain that nice little bird, but anything bigger than an R2 is ... well.... Ist try:- www.youtube.com/watch?v=-7nHh7KicC81st hover:- www.youtube.com/watch?v=AldAJt3OtCQRead "Chickenhawk" by Robert Mason. Flying grunts in Vietnam. Great book! That little bird is part of the fun in FC4, guys - and no I don't use it as a quick way to grab towers - I do exactly what Mikey Weeks does. He DA MAN! 2 centavos |
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Post by JRavens on Aug 31, 2015 1:25:48 GMT
Well of course I do realize everyone has a different play style etc. but I really do think you are not remembering how difficult Far Cry 2 was. There was no autosave system and you had no fast travel or air vehicles. The distances may not have been AS vast, but the player and vehicles were slower as well. You could easily lose a half hours progress by being killed. And frankly you should. I've been asked many times about a "death penalty" in both 3 and 4. Maybe Jajay drops his stuff or loses all of it. Maybe he loses some XP etc. There should be danger in getting back to safety. That's what made FC2 safe houses worthwhile. It was a risk / reward thing to take one just so (A) you could save your progress and (B) so you would have a save spot in the area you could double back to without having to resort to a long trek back somewhere else. Now lets be honest about this "vast" landmass I keep hearing about. Honestly? There's very few places in the main world space you can't take a land vehicle and get to a safe house within 1 or 2 real world minutes. It's just not THAT big and there are villages and outposts scattered strategically throughout. I'm not buying the whole it's too far away thing. If anything it's not far enough. Africa seemed much bigger. If you are playing with weapon damage SO high that you are afraid that you can't escape via vehicle from combat then maybe you have pushed the envelope on damage a little too far... Or if you want it that real - well there you go. It's real. In reality you can get shot while driving your car. Also in reality you don't fly an aircraft that requires almost NO skill (or training) to use. The thing literally can hover in place with no input form the user. Honestly even if the gyrocopter had even slightly realistic physics I would say it would be better balanced, but since you can focus on bombarding the enemy from beyond his range to engage you with one handed M79 rounds then yeah - it's really an exploit. I'm not saying anyone HERE would use it as an exploit, but isn't the point of difficulty mods to remove even the ability to exploit? We take away enemies on the minimap so there is no temptation to even use it. The reason I see it as a "toy" is because besides the ease of use the game really doesn't throw any counters against it. You don't run across enemy buzzers or helicopters. There's no AA from the ground unless you get too close to an RPG guy (which IS kind of cool to dodge RPGs). No flak cannons. Not even eagles who are more than happy to take half your health on the ground will contest you in the air. It's simply the safest mode of travel in the game to the point that it might as well be fast travel 2.0. It's FAR more dangerous to take a glider (what the hell DID they do to the gliders?!?) or even the wingsuit. I'm hope I'm not attacking anyone's play style so please don't take offense. I'm just throwing my 2 cents in from my experiences. Everyone likes different things. I get it. I'm just not ready to agree that it's critical to have the buzzer in order to play Far Cry 4 (on any difficulty) PS - for the record I do think the hovercraft is a toy too, but at least it's much more difficult to control.... which is odd. PSS - again my apologies if my reply came out too strong. I tend to get passionate in my replies. NOT attacking anyone! Honestly just playing Devil's advocate >  |
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rats...
I ALWAYS want to be at a safe house, to unload the loot bag if nothing else and use the known save feature of advancing time via the bed feature, then use the save button, then exit. I know that system actually works.